Patterns instead of trends: what we know and what we don’t know

Bryan Montpetit 00:08 Renato is the CEO of MZ insights. Renato, as I mentioned before, and just doesn't really need an introduction, because everybody knows, you know, he's written three books. He's been around the industry forever. He's an expert in everything. Localization translation, I mean, you name it, he's got it done. And he knows everything about it. So I mean, do I really need to say more? Rinaudo? Really? Renato Beninatto 00:34 I know, I know about myself, I don't know about the people who are listening. Thank you for the warm introduction. I'll be happy to, to thank you for the invitation. I've started early this morning, following the presentation, it's been a great conference, good job in organizing this. Congratulations. Bryan Montpetit 00:53 Thank you. Thank you very much. I appreciate it. And you're going to be presenting a patterns, not trends. I believe what we know what we don't. So what I'll do is I'll actually hand over the proverbial virtual mic to you and you can take it away. Very good. Renato Beninatto 01:07 Thank you so much. Bryan Montpetit 01:08 Thank you. I'll hop back in at the end just to give you a time cue and we'll take questions and answers. Okay, can Renato Beninatto 01:13 you see the right slide here? Or are you seeing my presenter slide? Bryan Montpetit 01:18 I'm not seeing anything as of yet. Oh, okay. Renato Beninatto 01:21 So hold on a second, I need to share. You know, this is always a little bit tricky. Hold on a sec. Where? Oh, here we go. Where's my little panel? Bryan Montpetit 01:42 People? I was dancing on tables. We're all good. Renato Beninatto 01:47 Well, I stopped doing that. Now. You're a married man. Bryan Montpetit 01:52 I go back a long way. Okay. Thank you very much. Renato Beninatto 01:55 Okay. So I am assuming you can see the right screen right now. Yes, we can. Okay, perfect. So it's a hold on, let me just organize my screen here. It seems like the word of the day is uncertainty. We're all trying to figure out how to get ready for future. And I've seen a lot of presentations today, talking about the pandemic. And the fact is that today, everybody has the same data, we're looking at the reality we're looking at going on in the world, we know what the present is, we have the same data. And I can safely say that we have the same ignorance regarding the future, what is going to happen, and this is what we're all trying to do. If we want to put this in the context of how Donald runs, Rumsfeld said he was the Secretary of Defense under George Bush, and people gave him a hard time and made a lot of fun of him. But he said that there are known knowns, there are things that we know, we know, we also know, that are known unknowns, which are the things that we know that we don't know. But there are also the unknown unknowns. And these are the ones that we don't know that we don't know. And if we want to put this in a two by two grid, we're now living in what Rumsfeld would have defined as the unknown unknowns. We are not aware that actually, we were not aware that the pandemic of this magnitude could happen. And we don't understand and we were not prepared, how to deal with it. So we're essentially swimming in the dark. I'm always asked to talk about trends. I do it every year, people like me and some of the other people that you have talked to and you have listened to today. Take the pulse of the industry and share our evaluations with people like you who want to aggregate all this information from multiple sources, and make decisions informed decisions about your businesses. A year ago, I would have not told you that the direction of the industry was going to crash into a wall. We like to use this beautiful words like analysis, assessment, projection, prediction forecast, and and we forget to use, especially in a situation like this, that what we're making is actually a guess with different implications. So what I want to talk to you and I've been talking about this recently is the difference between the trend and the pattern. It's being asked to talk about trends. We are always being asked to talk about something that is developing and changing And we can see where it's going. A pattern is something that is cyclical that you can predict because it happens, following a setter, a certain repetitive approach. So there are things that at a high level, we can predict. And I see patterns frequently in interactions that I have with people like you, my colleagues in the industry, and even the questions that I receive when I talk to investors and other LSPs translators buyers, and these questions, they tend to be cyclical. Everybody asks the same questions, but at the same time, so something like when is machine translation, or when is a new technology going to eliminate the need for something or they're also very frequently opinion based, instead of fact, based or supported by data, like the commoditization of the industry, people have been talking about this for 20 years. And we haven't seen that really happen. But the only fact is that most of these conversations are based on what I call exaggerations or myths that tend to circulate in the story. So let's quickly talk about four patterns that I have observed over the years and then use them to think together about how the market is likely to look like like after the pandemic. So before COVID-19, even when there were recessions, we never really had a situation of global crisis with massive layoffs, huge price drops and bankruptcies. The industry has generally grown at a faster pace than the economy, and has been this is quite predictable. And we have been doing that over time. Here it means we recently launched the ranking of the top 100 companies that we call the minzu 100. And and with an in depth analysis of the market in 2019, and our guesses for 2020. So last year, even though the growth has slowed. So the top 100 companies in 2018 grew 17 and a half percent. And last year, they grew 11 and a half percent. They were still growing right the market was still growing at at a healthy rate for an industry of this size. So in this slide here, you can see some breakdown in the growth rates for the different bands in our ranking. The full report, which you can download for free in our website contains a lot more detail on these numbers, including the growth rate according to the number of employees. When we finished writing the name 01 100 in February 2020, earlier this year, the Coronavirus hadn't been declared a pandemic yet, but it's written there in the printed version, we alerted to the fact that the translation industry will be impacted in the same proportion as the industry that it serves, both negatively and positively, in our projection for 2020 Was that the industry would reach $57 billion. And it would be continued, it would continue to grow at a compound annual growth rate of 6.2%. This was already a reduction from the 7% that we had estimated in 2018. Well, given the circumstances, we have adjusted our projections, because the current reality created a lot of uncertainty like the first word that I sent today. And so I created four different scenarios for 2020. There is a best case scenario in which the industry will grow by two and a half percent this year. Another possibility is that we say that nothing is going to happen and and we stayed the same we stay as we are. Then there is the original, the yellow one is the original names the 100 prediction of 6.2%. And then there is a worst case scenario where we see a contraction in business of about 10% Compared to last year. And by the way, I'm talking about the aggregate numbers of the industry I'm not talking about At individual companies, naturally, different companies in different segments are going to have different impact. But this line here, they it shows the same numbers from the previous lives in a in a line graph. So once the economy recovers, and we we don't know when, but it will recover. Once the economy recovers, we will, sorry, something popped up here in front of my screen. What we will see, I predict that the growth is going to be slower, but we're going to have at least a 5% growth for the following years in all the scenarios. So as I mentioned before, this is very fluid. A month ago, when I first presented this numbers, the OECD had expected that the global GDP would diminish by half of what they had previously forecasts. So instead of 3%, the global economy would grow by one and a half percent. This week, the IMF, the IMF, the internationally International Monetary Fund, predicted that the global economy will shrink by 8.7%. So instead of growing one and a half, by the OECD, the IMF predicts that there is going to be 8.7% reduction in all of the economy. So you see, the numbers are all over the place. And it's very hard to choose where you want to go. So one of the company that has been looking at this very closely and has been used by several governments to inform their decisions is McKinsey and Company, they developed many scenarios for the impact of the pandemic. So in this graph, you can see they say that the the general expectation is that one of the scenarios in this shaded area, a one to a four, are the most likely to materialize in each one of the cases, the spread of the diseases, or the contagion is controlled, and the catastrophic, catastrophic structural economic damage, as they call it is avoided. So these scenarios describe a global average. And the situations will naturally vary country by country, and the timing will vary country by country. But in all four of these scenarios, you have either a V, or a U shaped recovery, the V shaped is faster, and the U shaped, is a little slower. You can also think of more extreme scenarios, and these are the ones in the white quadrants. And even the optimist in me. couldn't help but notice that the except with the exception of big three, the one in the lower left corner, all of the scenarios predict recovery. And that is the pattern. Remember, we're talking about patterns. Keep in mind that what drives growth in our industry is not only the number of words, but also the proliferation of languages. John Juncker, who publishes the web globalization report card had this in his latest report, indicating that the number of languages supported by most the biggest global brands more than doubled in the last 10 years, and the tendency is to increase if I if I'm not mistaken. The top 25 companies have in average 65 languages. So the number of languages keeps increasing. The other element in complexity that contributes to the growth in in in our business, is this ever changing technological landscapes that companies need to deal with? This, this proliferation of file formats creates a demand for new project management skills, engineering services, and other activities that keep the LSPs alive. So the first pattern was this pattern of growth. We agree on that even if there's going to be a dip, there's going to be a rebound in growth coming forward. The second pattern is a pattern of constant change on the buyer side. So translation and localization keep changing homes inside the client organization. Because they have reorganizations, there are mergers, acquisitions, and all of these forces this this language services units to move from one internal group to another, regularly. So the reason why you won't see a VP of localization in most companies is because localization is mostly a support activity, it's a consequence of some other activities that are primary. So this pattern is what also keeps the LSP landscape alive because clients will change vendors cyclically, as their organization changes as their organizations grow. So growth, centralization, and decentralization, we come into the third pattern that I in. This is a pattern of automation of new processes. Earlier today, I don't know if you saw it on the PowerPoint presentation talking about if you had crappy software before, you continue to have crappy software in 3456 months after we come out of this situation. But what happens is that there is always automation, and it doesn't necessarily make it make things better. So it means that we publish this language technology Atlas, you have a little screen capture on the left there, where we track all the language related technologies. You can download it, this is the one for 2019, we're already updating the poster for 2020. And in the this one, there were like 400 companies listed as a technologies listed, we have over 530 already for 2020. The pattern is that as more languages, more file formats, new tasks and new services, required translation and localization in the industry creates this new technologies to automate and eliminate or expedite manual activities. And as the technology they hold the volumes grow, new technologies are necessary to audit automate the new manual processes that are a result of the previous cycle of automation. So it's like, step by step, you automate, you create new tasks with this new automation, you need to automate again and again, and again. And we've been going through this for for a long, long time. And that's how it will establish a pattern. It's something that is cyclical, and repetitive. Another word that is associated with with the technology and with automation, is the concept of innovation. And it's one of those words that sometimes I feel and you probably do to feel that it's quite overused. And it's been for a while, innovation was something that you only saw in the titles of certain people head of innovation, Chief of innovation and so on chief innovation officers, but innovation in our industry tends to be incremental only. So it's I used to say that everybody was trying to outdo tribal struggles, increase productivity by 1% 2%. And we seldom have what people call disruptive innovation, the one that really changes the lending landscape and the way we work with things. The last disruptive innovation that we had in the industry was Google Translate. And this was, I don't know, 15 years ago. And if you think moving from Google Translate to neuro translation was an incremental innovation, it was not a disruptive innovation. So the bright side of this is in here again, a pattern is that every time that you have a downturn in the economy, you have the opportunity and it's when disruptive innovations appear. And disruptive innovations usually come from outside of the industry. Not from inside of the industry. So I keep wondering what is going to come out of this pandemic, and what part of our industry is going to be disrupted? And by whom? I'd like to when we talk about automation, and I mentioned before, in this cyclical element that I often get asked, When is the machine going to replace the human, I like to make clear that there is a big difference between a complicated process in a complex process, right. And we live in an industry that deals with complex, complicated problems, they are things that are hard to solve. But if you follow rules and instructions, like how to build an engine, how to repair a mechanical problem, how to address a software bug, those are things that can be done, they're complicated, but if you follow if you have a certain amount of knowledge, and if you have a certain tools or experience, you can solve a complicated problem. On the other hand, complex problems, they have many unknowns, like the unknown unknowns, right. And there are too many factors that are interrelated, that it's very hard to summarize into organized into roles and processes. So a new technology comes in a new competitor appears in the market with a different model from yours. These are complex problems, they require management, they required strategy, they require preparation, and they require entrepreneurship, they required the need to take, make decisions and take risks. So there is no algorithm that will help you or will tell you how to respond to a complex problem. So when you think of an industry that is dealing with multiple languages, multiple formats vary number of languages, formats, process processes, locations. This is the type of complexity that you if you're an LSP have to handle and this is why the computer has not replaced you. And machine translation hasn't killed your business as many Cassandra's predicted just a few years ago. So solving complex problems that contain a lot of changing variables is what keeps our industry alive. And this is part of the pattern of automation. So the fourth and last pattern that I have observed in the industry, is a pattern of fear. Fear is unpleasant is an emotion that is driven by thinking that someone something a situation or something is dangerous. So there is danger related to it. And our fear is usually caused by a fear of pain or a threat coming from the outside. We're constantly afraid of competition of price drops, technology changes, and things that are outside of our control. But change only happens in moments of fear, uncertainty and doubt, as they say, Fudd, right. And we are right now in the middle of this macro change moment where everybody is affected in one way or another positive or negative, but we don't know. And this uncertainty drives this fear. And this is a great moment for change. I've been talking a lot with executives and owners of LSPs of all sizes from the biggest to very small ones from California based large enterprise suppliers to small companies in Latin America or Europe. And what I have learned is that companies are finding out that there are expenses that they don't need. My CFO is super happy, because my credit card has no charges and not traveling. So this is an opportunity to look at your expenses and make hard decisions, as they say, Never waste a good cry crisis. They say that this was a Winston Churchill phrase, but I couldn't get anybody to I couldn't find any source of that. But it's a great recommendation, never waste a good crisis. Another point that I want to make around this, this concept of crisis is that I don't know about you. But a very common recommendation is take, use this free time that you have acquired to look into your processes and improve and create etc. I don't have any more time, I've never worked so much as I have now because I don't have the excuse to commute to the office or travel around the world. So if you are if you have the opportunity to look and make changes in your organization, because you have the free time, I bet you is much better than just staying home and watching Netflix. As they say, with every challenge, there is an opportunity. So now that we have looked at these four patterns, let's look at some things that we hear it means they have identified opportunities and challenges for LSPs in 2020. Some will be more affected by the virus than others, but most of them are still valid. So coming out of 2019. And looking into 2020, the two biggest challenges for LSPs were scalability and capability. Content continues to grow in finding the right time and finding the right people and investing in the technologists to automate repetitive tasks is still a key factor in this process. As you know, because of your own behavior, our attention span, have has dropped to about seven seconds. So I don't know how you're keeping up with following this whole presentation. But video content like we're using here has become a lot more popular these days doesn't affect only the media localization, but also traditional LSPs who have to adopt new strategies or build new services to include the subtitling and dubbing and things like that. This is an area that is expected to grow even more when 5g becomes more widespread. And we'll make we'll talk a little bit about that a little later. Needless to say, media localization is booming. You all read the news about how Netflix has increased their sales. Mostly on in the international front, they're doing great, Amazon is doing great. All these new OTT platforms like this, they plus Apple TV plus Hulu. I flicks in Asia. So and there is a lot of mergers and acquisitions happening in this space. As you see here in this slide, the there's going to be a dip and most of you will not even notice that. But for the past couple of months, studios have stopped filming and and new productions will be delayed. So there's going to be a dip at this this market is pretty hot right now. But there are no new productions and dubbing studios have been closed in most countries. So there is some in the language services side there is some impact in there. So the other point that 2020 is bringing is this area of technology. That is in everybody's mind this concept of digital transformation will continue. And buyers ask LSPs more and more to deliver not only localization, but also to localize into multiple formats, because they have different distribution channels for their content. So lots of opportunity here. There is also the interpreting side, lots of new technologies in the interpretation side. And the goal when it comes to technology is to focus on delivering an easy, efficient and transparent experience for all the parties involved. Here we list examples of three companies that have done that. So digital created a cloud based platform to do. Dubbing and subtitling CQ fluency company in New Jersey has deployed a system for managed services that is built on. commonly available technologies like blue net and memo Q, and STI media, the parent company of SBI, media bought a company called pixel logic, and they are working with distribution services in the media industry. The other key challenge and we go here and we look at what which is in everybody's plate is the element of talent acquisition. Growth in volume is in growth in industry growth, the first pattern that I talked about, and technology and automation are not enough to let me put it in a different way, there are not enough people to do all the work that there is in the market, you might have gloves, maybe you have a lot of Spanish and Chinese translators available in the market. But if you look across the board, there is lack of talent in the market for the requirements that LSPs have today. So this doesn't apply only to translators and interpreters, but also to voice actors, project managers and other in house roles that LSPs have. So there's still a lot of opportunity in this space. Another challenge is that this big hype about machine translation, I don't know if you have observed, but in the last year and a half, it hasn't been so touted and talked so much about it's something that the industry has incorporated. The industry is using more. But there is a perceived plateau that has arrived. So given the current level of machine translation that has been widely accepted, adopted, we observe that any additional investment or investment only brings marginal improvements, we're going back to the incremental innovation instead of disruptive innovation in this space. So if you're still thinking about machine translation, you're late, deal with it, incorporate it into your processes, it's it's something that is a natural part of of reality. In 2019, it looked like interpreting was preparing for what was going to happen in 2020. And interpreting came out of the shadows and became big business. We published the top 23 interpretation companies in the world, which you can also download from our website. Language line was the number three in the nearly 100 in the industry as a whole. And it is by far the largest player and they have revenue of about 400 almost half a billion dollars, right. And while this industry is mostly composed of small players, there is a lot of m&a and centralization happening because of large government contracts that have been consolidated. So this slide gives you some some data here. So in the UK, for example, the big word went from 45 million to $120 million in three years after it took over the contract with the Ministry of Justice that used to be run by capita and we all remember how what a big mess that was. So for them in 2019, interpreting was 50% of the revenue, we need to watch what is going to happen in 2020 Because a lot of onsite interpretation has been significantly affected by by the pandemic. When we wrote the report. Remote Interpreting was finally getting some visibility but this mandated quarantines and the cancellation of events all over the world gave virtual interpreting the boost that it was wanting for. We used to say that it was a solution in search of a problem. Well, the problem showed up and the solution is their remote interpretation, which virtual interpretation and over the phone interpretation are areas of growth in our industry. So let's talk a little bit about this. Other emerging opportunities and buzzwords if you want. So I'll go very briefly around this for the sake of time, but Asia, especially India, are the most promising geographical areas for growth. If you you may not be feeling this in the US in Europe. But in 2019, these areas especially China and India have been booming. And not only as consumers of Western products, but also intra Asia. So there is a huge demand, especially in media in gaming for Asia to Asia content. Chinese into Korean Korean leader Japanese, Japanese into Thai, China and Korea are taking the lead also in 5g and blockchain. And this drive is driving the development of new platforms and new formats, right. Southeast Asia is thirsty for streaming content and company like iflix. is thinking over the traditional media over the air media right? telenovelas, which were usually South American products are now being produced in in, in South Korea, Turkey and exported all over the world. So in 2020, more than 50% of the global revenue in the video games industry was will be generated in Asia, and China will for the first time overtake the United States in mobile gaming, right. So there is a lot of activity going on. And the biggest challenges for the localization companies are to create a new supply chain that is not focused on converting content into English and then into other languages, but then be able to deal with the local demands. This has especially has a lot of impact, because translating into English creates an additional step that adds cost. And those markets are quite price sensitive. Look at India, where the assumption was that with English, you could address most of the market. But that's not true. Don't be surprised you see companies doing 1520 4045 Indian languages as a standard fare, because that there is a demand in the market for that. I'd like to very quickly mention 5g, it's we don't know what we don't know, like I said in the premise of this presentation, what 5g is going to do. But 5g is not only about a faster cell phone, or growth in Media and Gaming. It's really a game changer because it allows the internet of things to happen. And this will generate new products, new content that will affect document translation, especially in the manufacturing IT industry, document help video all kinds of content will be generated with this revolution that happens every 20 years when a new generation of technology comes out. So be prepared. There's very little that you can do to be prepared but be prepared because that is where the rebound is going to take us. 5g The last thing that I want to say is machine interpreting is something that is starting to appear in the horizon. And it's just a concept that no one in the industry has been taking seriously But if you use Google Skype, they have integrated machine interpreting as a free feature into their offers. So the market has a lot of devices that are being used for this type of of things. We have looked recently at a company called worldly. They have simultaneous speech to text and speech to speech services for conferences, and corporate meetings. This is an automated process. And Voyager translates from the big word that is designed for the military, for example, also contains a lot of machine interpreting. I believe honestly that this gadget part of the machine interpreting is overhyped. You see a lot of advertisement on Facebook and Instagram of these tools where people go to the park and start picking up ladies or making new friends. I think that this is a fad, and it's going like an exam here and disappear like Pokemon Go. And please the one those of you who still play Pokemon Go, don't be angry of me. Anyway, this was the presentation. Thank you for participating. I hope we have a little bit of time for questions. We don't know if you've been monitoring them, Brian, but I think that there is some movement here. We'll be happy to answer that. Bryan Montpetit 41:32 There is definitely and thank you for that presentation. Renato. It's great. And we have, as expected quite a few questions that came in. One of the first ones was based on your earlier graphs of prediction of trends, or patterns. Saying that you expect things to go back up around 2021? Is that I think it was more of a clarification question than anything. Renato Beninatto 41:57 I'm putting 2021 Because I don't know. You saw in the in the McKinsey graph, there are many, many possible curves. To be honest, I my guess is as good as yours, I have no idea of Bryan Montpetit 42:12 what pretty sure are than mine. But Renato Beninatto 42:16 so but anyway, if and I don't know if you can see in this graph here, they don't put a year or a time. So I'm just for convenience, I'm putting a prediction that whenever that tip ends, we're going to take off again, that's the perfect, Bryan Montpetit 42:36 very good, do predict some some specific areas where disruptions can actually happen in our industry. So Renato Beninatto 42:43 the problem with this eruption is that you can predict, right? Like I'm saying, We you can put bets in different areas. There are areas where people are looking at, but the the characteristic of disruptive innovation is that it comes from where you least expect, right? It's something that it's not you're doing your day to day. And this is why disruptive innovation comes from the outside of the industry, they're trying to usually solve a problem that is different from the problem that we as industry players are trying to do. So when you think of Google Translate, Google Translate was not trying to solve a translation problem. It was trying to solve an advertisement problem for Google because their business is to sell advertising, right? So or sharing information in multiple languages, it wasn't really translation. So this eruption is going to happen where you least expect. So probably where you're spending all your money, whoever asked it. Bryan Montpetit 43:44 Very good. All right. With respect to I mean, we have What rules do you think that translators will start to assume apart from post editing? In what sense are what skill sets? Do you recommend that they learn? Renato Beninatto 43:59 As a translator, your your your job is keep current and keep open to learning new skills. Like I said, In the beginning, whatever I say is going to be a guess. But what is sure, and this is what I tell my children today is it's not important, what we know and what we learn, but that we learn how to learn. So be one of the challenges that I have with my peers, people from age is that they're getting tired. They don't want to learn anymore. They're bored. And they're kids. They delegate stuff to their kids, you need to be like your kids. You need to be in this is one of the characteristics of translations. Translators, in general, is this curiosity, this ability to learn new things. Keep in mind that for those of you working in localization and technology, you're are already translating the future, you're translating the next generation of technology that has not been published yet. You're dealing with words that didn't exist six months ago. So keep that if you want to stay in business, and there's always going to be a demand for top notch professionals. As long as you are developing yourself and developing your skills, you are going to have work. Bryan Montpetit 45:24 Fantastic insight. I appreciate that. I guess one of the questions you mentioned, technical in terms of someone's ability to the project managers ability. So what is technical nowadays? I mean, obviously, we're dealing with emerging file formats and whatnot, do you have a way of defining or framing what technical is now? Renato Beninatto 45:44 Okay, so, let me let me put it this way, I come from my what informs my my, my analysis, and my research is the foundation that I have learned many years ago in manufacturing, which is total quality management, right, the concept of total quantity. And there are 14, if you have the chance, the participants here, go and search for the Demings, 14 points, right. So then they find this 14 points. And there are many things that I learned that that apply to any process that manufacturing or non manufacturing. And the key thing is that the more handoffs you have, the more opportunity you have to create, or incorporate errors. So I'm constantly typing. And when we talk about automation, optimization, and so on, is removing manual steps. So receiving an email and forwarding an email, even though it's technologically nature, receiving a file and forwarding a file, that's a manual step that can be automated, right? The more so what is technical and maybe I misunderstood your question is did you ask, what is technical content? And what is not technical? What is Bryan Montpetit 47:07 technical? What would you consider technical knowledge for for a project manager? Renato Beninatto 47:11 So it's, you know, everything is technology, everything is an expertise. It's it's focusing on a certain niche, right, a specialty, but having the ability to switch, if you're a legal translator, you need to understand whatever that contract is going to be about that contract might be a chemical patent. That contract might be related to manufacturing to software, that lawsuit that you're working on will have another subject. So you need to have multiple skills, translators. Bryan Montpetit 47:51 Yeah, and I think in terms of the project management, so with all these emerging file formats, just stay current and learn how, what tools support them how to process them, those Renato Beninatto 47:59 absolutely in there is the there's a difference between skill and knowledge, right? Or skill and ability. You can learn a skill, you can develop a skill, but you cannot. So be if you're open to learning, like I said in the beginning, learn to learn, acquire the skills that you need, as you need. Bryan Montpetit 48:26 Great. I mean, thank you so much for your time today. I thought it was super insightful. I really loved the information and a lot of other people were saying same. So again, thank you for your time. I really appreciate it. We're gonna be launching a poll in a few seconds. I'm happy. Thanks. So I thought so as well. Renato Beninatto 48:45 This is fun. This is fun. Bryan Montpetit 48:49 Excellent. Thank you very much.